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	<title>Comments on: Metallic Paint or Metallic Pain in the wallet?</title>
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	<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html</link>
	<description>Saab 9-1, 9-3, 9-4x, 9-5, 9-7x News</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 11 Dec 2008 06:34:22 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Rune (the other one)</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57426</link>
		<dc:creator>Rune (the other one)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 22:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57426</guid>
		<description>saabseller, is it the dealer who reaps the award for the metallic paint option markup, or SAAB? (probably a 30/70 split?)

I think it might be better to market the metallic colours as premium colours. Tell the customers that if they want a more special and personalized car, they can pay extra for the shiny colours.

But then the limited choice between white, red and black will seem like extortion... Customers are pushed into paying extra for a merchandise that cost the same thing to produce.

As a dealer, you are probably interested in pushing as many cars on the road, so you can make money from the annual service checkups. Getting more cars out there by being more honest about the paint, that should help your business in the long run.

Traditionally, I have the understanding that SAAB has a good reputation as far as paint is concerned. A SAAB rarely corrodes as quickly as most German cars. Part of this is due to the paint, no? (the late 80&#039;s 900 models had some different painting technology introduced, so those would be the exception as far as SAABs are concerned?)

But, as someone who works in an industry plagued with options, I should probably not comment. In the early days, IBM made a tape streamer that could handle double capacity tapes and increase speed simply by replacing a PROM. These could be upgraded, just by replacing a chip. Production cost identical with the twice as expensive model of course. These days several software SKUs are differentiated with a mere license key. All customers have the same binary, yet a more expensive license key will unlock functionality seemingly not present in the &#039;cheaper&#039; versions.

And to an extent, a more expensive sound system in a car could be the result of some R&amp;D investments that need to be recouped. So even though a third-market radio costs half, it doesn&#039;t really matter much.

But I still feel cheated about the high price of the GPS option for my 9-3. In the end I bought an ugly thing that sticks to my window, but I saved a significant amount of cash that way. :(

If anything, a balance need to be struck. I have cut down on my beverage intake in restaurants... In most places the food is actually quite cheap, but order a coke and you end up paying (at least!) four times as much as you would in a grocery store. The result is that I end up enjoying the meal less and do not eat out unless I have to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>saabseller, is it the dealer who reaps the award for the metallic paint option markup, or SAAB? (probably a 30/70 split?)</p>
<p>I think it might be better to market the metallic colours as premium colours. Tell the customers that if they want a more special and personalized car, they can pay extra for the shiny colours.</p>
<p>But then the limited choice between white, red and black will seem like extortion&#8230; Customers are pushed into paying extra for a merchandise that cost the same thing to produce.</p>
<p>As a dealer, you are probably interested in pushing as many cars on the road, so you can make money from the annual service checkups. Getting more cars out there by being more honest about the paint, that should help your business in the long run.</p>
<p>Traditionally, I have the understanding that SAAB has a good reputation as far as paint is concerned. A SAAB rarely corrodes as quickly as most German cars. Part of this is due to the paint, no? (the late 80&#8242;s 900 models had some different painting technology introduced, so those would be the exception as far as SAABs are concerned?)</p>
<p>But, as someone who works in an industry plagued with options, I should probably not comment. In the early days, IBM made a tape streamer that could handle double capacity tapes and increase speed simply by replacing a PROM. These could be upgraded, just by replacing a chip. Production cost identical with the twice as expensive model of course. These days several software SKUs are differentiated with a mere license key. All customers have the same binary, yet a more expensive license key will unlock functionality seemingly not present in the &#8216;cheaper&#8217; versions.</p>
<p>And to an extent, a more expensive sound system in a car could be the result of some R&amp;D investments that need to be recouped. So even though a third-market radio costs half, it doesn&#8217;t really matter much.</p>
<p>But I still feel cheated about the high price of the GPS option for my 9-3. In the end I bought an ugly thing that sticks to my window, but I saved a significant amount of cash that way. <img src='http://www.trollhattansaab.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':(' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>If anything, a balance need to be struck. I have cut down on my beverage intake in restaurants&#8230; In most places the food is actually quite cheap, but order a coke and you end up paying (at least!) four times as much as you would in a grocery store. The result is that I end up enjoying the meal less and do not eat out unless I have to.</p>
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		<title>By: eggsngrits</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57415</link>
		<dc:creator>eggsngrits</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 17:50:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57415</guid>
		<description>Well said, Arnold.  I, too, do not begrudge dealers their profit, but I am disappointed that dealers often resort to trickery to get more money than the consumer is aware of or agreed to.

Saabseller, you are blaming us for reacting to years of trickery at the hands of dealers of all stripes?  Whole books are written to catalog all of the little ways that car dealers attempt to fatten their wallets!  Everytime another one of these areas (like this one) is exposed, consumers become more polarized to negotiate hard.  If you don&#039;t like that, I would suggest either finding another line of work or make sure that people think that they are getting a fair deal from you at a profitable level. 

Of course, competitive pressure may take its toll, in which case you can&#039;t blame the consumer for comparing and taking the better deal, can you?

I&#039;m not sure why you feel that this is unique to Saab.  I&#039;m sure that any dealer of any marque can claim the same lack of consumer trust.

Bottom line:  people want a fair deal.  Provide that and you will be successful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said, Arnold.  I, too, do not begrudge dealers their profit, but I am disappointed that dealers often resort to trickery to get more money than the consumer is aware of or agreed to.</p>
<p>Saabseller, you are blaming us for reacting to years of trickery at the hands of dealers of all stripes?  Whole books are written to catalog all of the little ways that car dealers attempt to fatten their wallets!  Everytime another one of these areas (like this one) is exposed, consumers become more polarized to negotiate hard.  If you don&#8217;t like that, I would suggest either finding another line of work or make sure that people think that they are getting a fair deal from you at a profitable level. </p>
<p>Of course, competitive pressure may take its toll, in which case you can&#8217;t blame the consumer for comparing and taking the better deal, can you?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure why you feel that this is unique to Saab.  I&#8217;m sure that any dealer of any marque can claim the same lack of consumer trust.</p>
<p>Bottom line:  people want a fair deal.  Provide that and you will be successful.</p>
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		<title>By: Arnold</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57402</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 12:26:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57402</guid>
		<description>saabseller, of course dealers need to make a profit. If they didn&#039;t, who would sell and service my cars? I&#039;m all for happy and profitable dealers (and manufacturers). It isn&#039;t the profit that bothers me. I just want an open transaction, without all the hidden &#039;extras&#039;. Otherwise I feel it amounts to a certain amount of deception. If I am quoted a price, it should include overheads and most normal features one would expect in a price. 
If most models were not metallic, I could see why that feature could be an extra, but when most are metallic, then that is what should be expected in the quoted price. In fact, the dealer could then say that he could give a discount if I chose a solid colour.
In short, I expect the dealer and salesman to make a satisfactory profit. I also expect them to be completely open, so that I don&#039;t have to be on the alert for unexpected charges. When I am quoted a price, I expect to write a cheque for that amount, because that is the quoted price.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>saabseller, of course dealers need to make a profit. If they didn&#8217;t, who would sell and service my cars? I&#8217;m all for happy and profitable dealers (and manufacturers). It isn&#8217;t the profit that bothers me. I just want an open transaction, without all the hidden &#8216;extras&#8217;. Otherwise I feel it amounts to a certain amount of deception. If I am quoted a price, it should include overheads and most normal features one would expect in a price.<br />
If most models were not metallic, I could see why that feature could be an extra, but when most are metallic, then that is what should be expected in the quoted price. In fact, the dealer could then say that he could give a discount if I chose a solid colour.<br />
In short, I expect the dealer and salesman to make a satisfactory profit. I also expect them to be completely open, so that I don&#8217;t have to be on the alert for unexpected charges. When I am quoted a price, I expect to write a cheque for that amount, because that is the quoted price.</p>
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		<title>By: saabseller</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57396</link>
		<dc:creator>saabseller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 07:27:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57396</guid>
		<description>I think that I like the idea of a drive away price best, and that is how I intend to negotiate any new purchase. It is fair enough to charge for options, but only when the majority of the models don’t have those features. IOW, most purchases will have to use the “option”. The extra charge that gets to me, is “dealer preparation”. Why not add electricity, rent and overtime costs on this basis?

In future, I will write a cheque for the full amount I am willing to pay in order to drive the car away, and be willing to walk away if it is not accepted. That should take care of metallic paint and charges for paper work. (Yes, paper work was another one, can you believe it?)

&lt;strong&gt;No matter how low the &quot;drive away price&quot; is, people won&#039;t pay it, especially Saab buyers, they will always want less. This is part of the problem with Saab, it is seen obscene that a dealer should make a profit of any amount on a sale. Then they all wonder why the trade is worth squat. If we were in the no profit/volunteer run business the sign outside would say Salvation Army SAAB.&lt;/strong&gt; Aren&#039;t we allowed to have a life too???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that I like the idea of a drive away price best, and that is how I intend to negotiate any new purchase. It is fair enough to charge for options, but only when the majority of the models don’t have those features. IOW, most purchases will have to use the “option”. The extra charge that gets to me, is “dealer preparation”. Why not add electricity, rent and overtime costs on this basis?</p>
<p>In future, I will write a cheque for the full amount I am willing to pay in order to drive the car away, and be willing to walk away if it is not accepted. That should take care of metallic paint and charges for paper work. (Yes, paper work was another one, can you believe it?)</p>
<p><strong>No matter how low the &#8220;drive away price&#8221; is, people won&#8217;t pay it, especially Saab buyers, they will always want less. This is part of the problem with Saab, it is seen obscene that a dealer should make a profit of any amount on a sale. Then they all wonder why the trade is worth squat. If we were in the no profit/volunteer run business the sign outside would say Salvation Army SAAB.</strong> Aren&#8217;t we allowed to have a life too???</p>
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		<title>By: mo</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57395</link>
		<dc:creator>mo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 06:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57395</guid>
		<description>arnold i am not speaking of the 900&#039;s, those were built like tanks, but now go over and look at saabcentral in the 9-3 section and you will see many complaints about paint quality, including mine were there are small red spots everywhere, and it seems like water puddles that were let to dry on my hood and rear deck lid. its shameful how such an expensive car has such a poor paint finish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>arnold i am not speaking of the 900&#8242;s, those were built like tanks, but now go over and look at saabcentral in the 9-3 section and you will see many complaints about paint quality, including mine were there are small red spots everywhere, and it seems like water puddles that were let to dry on my hood and rear deck lid. its shameful how such an expensive car has such a poor paint finish.</p>
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		<title>By: Arnold</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57390</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 02:33:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57390</guid>
		<description>I think that I like the idea of a drive away price best, and that is how I intend to negotiate any new purchase. It is fair enough to charge for options, but only when the majority of the models don&#039;t have those features. IOW, most purchases will have to use the &quot;option&quot;. The extra charge that gets to me, is &quot;dealer preparation&quot;. Why not add electricity, rent and overtime costs on this basis?

In future, I will write a cheque for the full amount I am willing to pay in order to drive the car away, and be willing to walk away if it is not accepted. That should take care of metallic paint and charges for paper work. (Yes, paper work was another one, can you believe it?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that I like the idea of a drive away price best, and that is how I intend to negotiate any new purchase. It is fair enough to charge for options, but only when the majority of the models don&#8217;t have those features. IOW, most purchases will have to use the &#8220;option&#8221;. The extra charge that gets to me, is &#8220;dealer preparation&#8221;. Why not add electricity, rent and overtime costs on this basis?</p>
<p>In future, I will write a cheque for the full amount I am willing to pay in order to drive the car away, and be willing to walk away if it is not accepted. That should take care of metallic paint and charges for paper work. (Yes, paper work was another one, can you believe it?)</p>
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		<title>By: Arnold</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57389</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 02:23:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57389</guid>
		<description>mo, My 900 is now 15 years old, and the paint, apart from some minor stone chips, is not much different from the day I bought it. It is very good quality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mo, My 900 is now 15 years old, and the paint, apart from some minor stone chips, is not much different from the day I bought it. It is very good quality.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Rupert</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57387</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Rupert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 01:43:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57387</guid>
		<description>I liked the article, Eggs.

Volvo charges about $495 more for metallic paint, but I don&#039;t know how that affects durability. Despite the 10 year warranty on paint, our dealership also offers &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.xzilon.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Xzilon&lt;/a&gt; treatment for the paint and interior to further protect against bird droppings, stone chips, and vandalism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I liked the article, Eggs.</p>
<p>Volvo charges about $495 more for metallic paint, but I don&#8217;t know how that affects durability. Despite the 10 year warranty on paint, our dealership also offers <a href="http://www.xzilon.com/" rel="nofollow">Xzilon</a> treatment for the paint and interior to further protect against bird droppings, stone chips, and vandalism.</p>
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		<title>By: Bernard</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57382</link>
		<dc:creator>Bernard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 00:30:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57382</guid>
		<description>The metallic paint surcharge is one of those things that you can probably negotiate away if your dealer is motivated (and what dealer isn&#039;t these days?). The important thing is the bottom line.

If pricing was really truthful, you would see a line item for &quot;R&amp;D and Tooling&quot; worth about half of the car price, 10% labour, 30% for various people taking their cut, and roughly $200 for raw materials (which is the scrap value of the car).

The important thing is that you agree with the bottom line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The metallic paint surcharge is one of those things that you can probably negotiate away if your dealer is motivated (and what dealer isn&#8217;t these days?). The important thing is the bottom line.</p>
<p>If pricing was really truthful, you would see a line item for &#8220;R&amp;D and Tooling&#8221; worth about half of the car price, 10% labour, 30% for various people taking their cut, and roughly $200 for raw materials (which is the scrap value of the car).</p>
<p>The important thing is that you agree with the bottom line.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Baculy</title>
		<link>http://www.trollhattansaab.net/archives/2008/11/metallic-paint-or-metallic-pain-in-the-wallet.html#comment-57366</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Baculy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Nov 2008 21:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.trollhattansaab.net/?p=10681#comment-57366</guid>
		<description>We certainly don&#039;t charge extra for the application of metallic paints.  For multi-stage pear paints, but thats about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We certainly don&#8217;t charge extra for the application of metallic paints.  For multi-stage pear paints, but thats about it.</p>
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