Detroit Travel Notes - Day 3 - with classic quote of the event so far, from Kid Rock.
Another day passes in Detroit, and it shall be known as the day I didn’t carry my camera enough. Consequently, I have no photos from the GM Style event that I attended tonight, but I do have some good notes….
Buckle up, long post coming…..
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The day started with lunch at Fishbones, meeting up with a few Saab people in the process. Long-time commenter and 9-5 advocate, Greg Abbott was there, along with Erica, whom he’s just sourced a non-turbo 900 for in Minnesota. Erica’s planning a big drive up to Labrador with a few friends in 900s and wanted a non-turbo model for the job - less bits means less to go wrong. 
We were all joined by ‘SaabWookiee’ - who’s yet to make his first Saab purchase but has been studying the form guide religiously. I think if and when Saab get the EDP back up and running, he’ll be a prime candidate. More on the EDP later….
I was determined to wear shorts at least one day while I was here in Detroit, and given that today was the warmest one on the forecast, out they came.
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I don’t want to offend any Americans here, but let’s just say that Detroit in winter isn’t quite Trollhattan in summer. It’s a pretty confronting place, actually. Well, where I am is, at least. I’m sure the people that live here have got their place in a nice suburb and a regular set of pleasant locations to visit, but the little I’ve seen of downtown so far is pretty sparse.
I hate to say it, but it doesn’t feel safe here. I don’t know if that’s my mind taking too much heed of the warnings I received about coming here, it’s just how I feel.
And given that there’s no minibar in the hotel room (there isn’t even a refrigerator) it makes a case of the munchies very difficult to address.
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Here’s the building that pretty much dominates downtown. It is, of course, the Renaissance Center, and it’s headquarters to GM as well as including a bunch of stores and several restaurants.
It’s an impressive structure from the outside. It was built in the mid-1970s and housed something-other-than-GM until they took it over in the mid-1990s. Inside, it’s a pretty confusing place, at first. You get used to it, but there’s a whole bunch of rampways and platforms that connect all the buildings together. And whilst it’s all steel and glass on the outside, it’s predominantly exposed concrete on the inside.
As you can see, the impressive structure isn’t complimented by too many similar buildings in the immediate surrounding area. I haven’t wandered too far and wide, but took this shot on my walk back from lunch to the RenCen, which is where my hotel is.
I felt at home in Trollhattan. I feel very far away from home here.
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After lunch came a few phone calls and then an early dinner with Jan-Willem Vester of SaabUSA prior to the GM Style event. This was situation 1 where a camera would have been handy.
Dinner was at the Coach Insignia restarant, which is on the 71st and 72nd floors of the center tower of the RenCen. It’s certainly an impressive setting and I can highly recommend the New York Strip Steak.
Jan-Willem and I covered a number of topics during dinner:
Saab 9-4x
JWV was quite positive about the unveiling tomorrow, which is to be expected, of course. I’m feeling pretty good about it too.
I’ll say it again, they’re just CGI’s that we’ve seen so far. The white background images made the vehicle look quite plain, but the images involving backgrounds were more promising. History has taught us all that it always looks better in the metal. More on the 9-4x later.
Capacity
When Gripen and I were down at Bob Sinclair’s place a few days ago, he mentioned that there’s no real reason why Saab shouldn’t be selling 100,000 cars in the US market.
With this in mind, I asked JWV what he thought Saab’s capacity was in the US and he came out with the same figure. This surprised me to some degree, but it’s a good sign. Read on….
The future
It’s hard to be patient.
Though we’re going to see the 9-4x in concept form tomorrow, it’s not likely to be on the market for another 18 months. That’s an agonisingly long time for a fan, a buyer and let’s face it, a dealer, but in the car industry it’s considered to be the blink of an eye.
Jan-Willem’s optimism for the future was based on things he’s seen that we haven’t seen yet. They need the models and….
The Marketing
I suggested that the accountants has really cut Saab’s throat in this area, but JWV remained supportive of the marketing budget that GM has given Saab based on the volume they sell.
I still suggest that they’re being strangled.
The Saab 9-1
We both got a good laugh out of the stories touting the 9-1 as a starter for the London Motor Show.
As JWV’s dealing with press all the time, he finds some of the stuff quite amusing, but also quite frustrating on many occasions.
Cadillac
Boy, did we have some discussion about Cadillac. JWV’s a GM guy and so his line on Cadillac was the same as it always has been. GM need Cadillac as a global premium brand. Saab isn’t equipped to take on the high level luxury marques from Europe and Japan, and nor should it be.
My line was the same as always, too. Trying to take Cadillac global is likely based on a business case that uses volumes for Cadillac outside the US market that will prove to be unreachable. The money would be better invested in Saab, which already has a global profile and could benefit more, and more quickly, from the investment and development.
I suspect the truth lies somewhere in between. JWV and I agreed to meet up again in the same spot in 5 years to see how things went.
Hatches
In relation to hatches, JWV acknowledged the love for the traditional Saab hatch, but asked where all the hatch lovers were when they were selling them and the configuration needed to be justified and saved?
SportCombi
On a related note to hatches, he noted the slow sales of the 9-3 SportCombi in the US.
Even though it gets rave reviews from magazines touting it as the Anti-SUV and a great, practical vehicle, they’re just finding them quite hard to move off the lot.
For the record, a 2.0T SportCombi would be my model of choice if I were in a position to buy new right now. They’re just so cool.
GM bashing
There was some particular frustration, which I can sympathise with, over the way the press covers not just Saab, but almost all GM vehicles.
Failures and corrections by Japanese manufacturers are generally covered as ‘persistance’. The same thing by GM is just covered as failure.
There’s also the instant and constant referral to platform-mates, despite the fact that this is usually followed by a qualifying destinction. e.g. something like “the Saab 9-3 shares the same platform as [insert generally-lower stable mate here] but you’d be hard pressed to know as it’s so assured…..”. As I said, I can sympathise with this as it’s frustrating to me, too. The car is 5 years old - people know about the relationships now. Get over it and if you mean to say it drives well, just say it drives well.
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After dinner, we headed down to the GM Style event - situation #2 where I wished I had my camera.
No doubt there’ll be heaps of photos on GM Media soon. Voila!
I had previously characterised the GM Style event as having high potential for being what I called a ‘wankfest’ (please pardon my Australian vernacular) as previous GM style events have involved celebrities just walking out with cars to some music, being applauded and then walking back.
It was better than expected.
The feature performers were Mary J Blige, Maroon 5 and Kid Rock and they all did a number of songs as accompaniment to the vehicles being shown. There were heaps of (human) models in various designer labels as well and it’s difficult to know who the crowd were watching more: the ladies, the performers or the cars.
Maroon 5 were my performers of choice, FWIW.
The Corvette ZR1, above, was the undoubted feature of the exhibition and was the only car to receive a real ovation. The other cars were certainly applauded, but the ZR1 was what the people came for.
Saab’s presence at the show took the form of the 2008 Saab Turbo X and it looked quite cool coming out from backstage with just the eyebrow lights showing.
Tomorrow will be my first personal viewing of the Turbo X, so I’m really looking forward to that.
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Some other notes from GM Style:
1. There was no better sight all night than watching Detroit mayor Kwame Kilpatrick, pimped out with black and white hat and dancing gangster-style with none other than Septigenerian car guy, Bob Lutz. Hilarious.
2. I caught up with Saab Sweden head honcho, Jan-Ake Jonsson there. As mentioned previously, he’s the only person I’ve ever met on three separate continents. For some reason that stands out to me.
Anyway, we talked a little about the 9-4x and the images, and then I asked if the interior we’ll see tomorrow is the one that will make it into the production vehicle. He indicated that most of it will make it through to production.
Obviously the single-seat chairs in the back row won’t make it, but if that dashboard setup is going to carry through then I, the skeptic, have at least one reason to get very excited about the future.
That interior is awesome.
3. Kid Rock had the quote of the night, though I’m sure the GM senior staff and associated others cringed if/when they heard it.
For those that don’t know, Kid Rock is a native Detroitian (if that’s the right word) so he quite loudly declared his pride in his blue-collar background, proclaiming
“In Detroit, we don’t buy shit, we build it”
I’m sure he meant well.
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Missed photo opportunity #3 happened in the middle of writing this article.
I popped downstairs for a breath of fresh air, and saw my first Saab 9-7x in action, and it was an Aero.
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The big show starts tomorrow.
Thanks for reading right through and I’ll get back with as many pics of the Saab 9-4x as I can muster as soon as possible.
——
Yoda to the Ren Center: Build a Saab hatch, you will….”
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“In Detroit, we don’t buy shit, we build it”
That is pure gold Jerry!!
18 months for the 9-4X would put it around July, 2009. So it’d either be a VERY late model-year 2008.5 or an early model-year 2010. I was expecting the 9-4X before then. Is all of Saab’s product being pushed-out as well? If I were a Saab dealer I’d be steaming mad.
You’re meeting-up with Jan-Willem in the same spot in 5 years? Are you sure you really want to return to Detroit? Why don’t you guys agree to meet in Trollhattan in 5 years? By then maybe Saab will be introducing the 9¹.
“Where were all the hatch lovers…”? They were buying Saab cars. During the 1980s when Saab had its best sales in the U.S. (60 straight months of sales growth) the hatch was overwhelmingly chosen over the notchbacks (9000CD and the 2 and 4 door C900). Let’s put it this way: Saab dropped the hatchback in 2003 because buyers supposedly would only buy sedans. Yeah, how’s that going sales-wise? I’d say that it wasn’t the hatch that was hurting sales. It’s the same with the V6. Allegedly prospective buyers wouldn’t even go into a Saab dealership because they didn’t offer a 6-cylinder. They have for a few years now (and they did for a short time in the mid-90s). Are the dealers flooded with prospective buyers there to buy a 9³ Aero?
I’m actually looking for a 9³ SportCombi to possibly replace my wife’s ‘01 OG9³. I’m not crazy enough to buy a new car though. Let someone else take that insane depreciation hit. However, it’s hard to find decent few-years old combis around here. I’ll keep looking.
Oh man, I’d pay money to get an MP3 sample of Kid Rock saying that. I’d make it my cell phone ring tone.
Thanks for the great writeup as always, Swade. Have fun tomorrow.
Oops, make that “…very late 2009.5…” Sorry.
Good entry to the blog Swade, you seem a bit more upbeat (should have flown business you bloody goose)
I was thinking about this while walking the Mutt this stinking hot morning, most of the rest of the decade Saab wise will probably be a bit frustrating as we wait for new models to arrive and start selling but i think as we head for the 2010s thinks will look significantly better. Saab drivers should be marked out for their optimism and patience. As i drive a rather superb MY2005 9-5 wagon it’s very easy to be optimistic and patient.
Lose the shorts mate…………
Thanks for the update. You must be seriously exhausted with your sleep schedule turned upside down.
PS - Kid Rock is not only a talentless, classless moron, he is irrelevant musically. The marketing people at GM should have better sense than to invite him, homegrown or not.
“…but asked where all the hatch lovers were when they were selling them…”
Well, they probably be popular now that BMW is going hatch… Because now, the auto journos will think they are great.
I have now finally seen some GM styling I like- the two female humans behind the car in the ’style’ event seem to have very taut panels adn some excellent compound cuirve interactions. A very nice down the road graphic with some tumblehome thrown in.
As for tha car- if you must….
I am worried that the 9-4X is badly timed, even if the car buyers in the US are a stubborn kind. The future is not with SUV/SAV/XUV/PUKE, the future is smaller.
So no girls on bikes in Detroit?
Jeff k is right - Kid Rock is a huge blight on the face of pop music.
I’m bullish on Caddy as a global brand. It will happen.
And, now you know why few people visit Detroit proper. They always are headed to a suburb for the most part.
Great stuff!!
Great summary man! Short rocks I am sure that you where the only one in Detroit last night who had shorts outside!
Think the 94 will be a success. Remember most people, right or wrong, do not care about polutions. Last year they sold 17,000 environmental cars in Canada, that is less than 1%. People still like their gas gustling trucks that are unsafe for everyone else.
Also, keep in mind that the Caddy was presented with hydrogene, and even if that is further down the road, GM already sell several models, incl the Vue, as hybrids so it would surprice me if that did not come to the 94 as well, maybe the first ethanol hybrid?
Keep all the good stuff coming, Swade. It’s awesome to sit down and read about your travels.
I vote more pictures though! And let’s not forget the Booth Babes….
No Americans were offended in your Detroit comments cause most Americans don’t like Detroit either! Ha! We’re not a tourist destination, if you want to see a beautiful midwest city, Chicago is the crown jewel. I love my hometown none-the-less. We have our faults and sometimes old stigmas hurt us, but heck, if you think downtown is sparse now, you should have seen it in the 80’s!! We really need to link up for that beer so I can try to erase some of the “bad” thoughts, there are things to do and places to see, you just have to know where to look. I spent all 4 of my high school years in downtown Detroit at Cass Tech so I got to know the place well. Plus being an avid sports fan, I am down there all the time to see the Tigers, Red Wings and once in a great while the Lions (but they suck still, ha). I could go on forever on Detroit’s problems and the solutions I have thought of, but this is not the forum for it. I am here to read about SAAB and it’s future and look forward to seeing the 9-4X today. Keep up the good work Swade and sorry I missed hanging out with you yesterday.
I had the privilege to travel a good chunk of the Western Cape during my obligatory December 07 recess and in all I counted 3 Saabs bar my 9-5 in a period of 21 days on the road.
I am getting tired of the GM marketing budget / Saab sales volume ratio. I met South Africans who told me pointedly at gas stations and car valets that they want to buy Saab but the brand is not marketed that well. In Cape Town they have the premium channel containing Saab, Hummer and Cadillac at N1 City. Yet not a single Saab in the showroom, no promotion materiel. But Hummer and Cadillac abounds. How does GM suppose prospective customers to buy a product which is not visible? Then GM has the audacity to say that adverts for Saab will appear in premium channels not to reach the potential buyers? Are they positioning Saab so high that the average buyer upscaling to a premium segment would not cast an eye in that direction? Funny - I counted numerous Caddy BLS’ and it pains to say those were potential 9-3 buyers.
Brilliant reporting. Enjoy but do not forget the visuals.
Danni,
Just the other day I read an article about the wine yards at the cape. Marvelous sceneries! Must be some of the most beautiful wine yards in the world.
As for the BLS… Yesterday, I actually saw my first BLS Wagon. And I live in Sweden… There can’t be many of them…
And Kid Rock lives up to his reputation. Welcome to America.
The GM style event still sounds like fun and it would have been cool to be there. I am going to get some media credentials next year and hang out.
That new ZR1 is a pretty big deal from an image standpoint and the supercharged engine is going to be in the new CTS-V. Not a ‘green’ car, but there you have it.
Break out the camera Swade and get some pictures next to those Cadillac’s!
1. a corvette stole the show?–gm’s got problems.
2. no hotel room refrig and $13/day internet?–…too backwards for me.
3. kid rock’s talent is to not have any. (and i enjoyed 1985 gripen’s ringtone idea, though.)
4. looking forward to 9-4 pictures. i hope my eyes deceived me a few days ago. i doubt, however, that it’ll be “conquest” material (i.e., compel people to switch brands), unless it’s for the interior.
5. a (hot) hatch will sell.
6. an entertaining post.
7. swade, what was your impression of the 9-7x aero “in-action”?
Again, Kid Rock does have talent, he just distracts you from it with his terrible music and talking. He really is good with the turntables.
Ken H - You’re right. Luckily, the 9-4x isn’t an SUV. SUVs are body-on-frame, CUVs are unibody. There is a huge difference.
ctm - The Western Cape wine cellars and the lot are really first class. Got a few of the precious liquid to add to my wine collection but the customs chap did not like my too many bottles and confiscated a good chunk.
Took some brilliants shots hibernating in Swade’s inbox whilst he is covering Detroit GM offerings.
The BLS - everytime I see one my wife says there goes another 9-3 sale.
My reaction to the statement that the 9-3 Combi isn’t selling well is that every dealer seems to put roof rails and moonroofs on them (”can’t sell the cars without these”,) pumping up the price ($1450) and detracting from the styling.
There are 5 Combi photos in the U.S. brochure without roof rails and two that show things sitting on top of the rails. Can’t see about moonroofs except for the one with the kayak (no moonroof.) The Aero has a moonroof as standard.
I am waiting for an ‘08 I ordered to be made without those items, in my color and options, since there were none in the U.S.
Swade, awesome write-up mate! And the shorts made my day - nice touch!
Brendan,
Its just not the same is it. I mean he got woke up by lots of loverly’s singing in the street back in June, this time it’s suits!!!!!
saab9x - If Corvette DOESN’T steal any show it’s at, there’s a problem. If the ZR-1 doesn’t excite some part of your heart of hearts, you’re dead inside.
blgaarder: I never thought of the extra options issue. I don’t know about the roof rails (I think the majority opinion is that the 9³ combi looks better w/o them), but as for the moonroof, I understand that a very large number of Saabs in the U.S. sell with the moonroof. It’s almost become a “must-have” option here.
I really like the idea someone who visits this site (sorry I forgot who) had to bring the 1.8t 9³ to North America, improve the interior, and sell it as a fuel-efficient entry-level Saab until we can get the 9¹. Obviously ship most of these w/o the sunroof to keep the base price down and attract buyers who want a “premium” car, but at a lower price point.
Danni: I was looking into the BLS because we don’t have them here and I see that not only are they selling them in South Africa, but also in Mexico now. I don’t know what Saab sales were like in Mexico before this (I doubt they were very popular there), but now that a Cadillac can be had around the same price, I would see it taking away sales down there. Mexicans really like American products and driving around a Cadillac there means you’ve “made it”. They have no idea what a Saab is or probably even where Sweden is…
Is it called a moon-roof ’cause you can moon people from it?